if you don't like it, don't read it. I don't believe anyone is twisting your arm. If Al does not respond the conversation will be over.
Al, I am not trying to beat a dead horse but we were having a discussion yesterday that I would like to continue if you are ok with it and as long as I am not kicked off the site.
I understand the points you made but I respectfully disagree. When Jesus said that He and the Father are ONE, I believe He was saying that They are One in the same person. I know this is difficult to understand and I am sure you have heard all these arguements before but not from me. There are a few passages that speak of Jesus being called Immanuel or Emmanuel, (either spelling is correct) which means "God with us".
Isaiah 7:14 (KJV)
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
Matthew 1:23 (KJV)
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
This was among many names for Jesus, including but not limited to, Messiah, Wonderful Counselor, Almighty God, Everlasting Father, and Prince of Peace.
See Isaiah 9:6 (KJV)
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Yes these passages from Isaiah are from the Old Testament but they are prophecies of Jesus as I am sure you know.
You stated that Jesus could not have been God cause God would not have taken 33 yrs off to be human. (I am not quoting you exactly but I think that is basically what you said). Well since God does exist in 3 forms as one, then He can still be sitting on His throne, be here on earth in the form of a man, and be everywhere else in the form of His Holy Spirit all at the same time. Why? Because He is GOD. He is omnipresent, omnipowerful and all knowing. (I am sure there is an "Onmi" word for all knowing but if there is it escapes me at this moment). The Bible says He knew you and me before we were even conceived. (this just barely scratches the surface of the characteristics of our Wonderful God.)
As for the Trinity, you are correct that it is never mentioned in the Bible as such but is definitely implied many times. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. I agree it is hard to understand. I liken it to H2O. Water exist in 3 forms; Liquid, Solid and Gaseous. They are all H20 but serve different functions.
That is a very simplistic view of the Trinity.
I would also like to apologize for conservative's attitude expressed on the post. I would hope that any of you who are looking at Christianity or to follow Jesus would do just that. Follow Jesus! Not me or conservative or Al or anybody else. Jesus is the only one from which Christianity is based. Anything other then biblical teaching regarding Jesus is false.
Al, I appreciate the show of respect. I will show you the same. Now to the subject of Jesus being God. He stated on several occasions that He and the Father are one. One instance is John 10:30 "I and the Father are one." (John 10:30 NASB).
After I send this I will probably be kicked off the site. Since I do not pay for this privilege. So our discussion I'm sure will be limited. But once again we have to agree that the Bible is the authority from which argue.
Another place you can look is John chapter 17. This is a beautiful prayer spoken by Jesus to the Father in which He declares that He is one with the Father.
Yes there are many instances where Jesus says that He is the son of God, the Messiah. But the reason He stated it this way was at least twofold. One was that those people knew that He was the son of Mary and thought that He was the son of Joseph. So they had seen Him grow up. And number two, is that they were not ready to hear the truth about Him being equal to God or being God Himself. If He would have stated this earlier in His ministry, they would have tried to killed Him immediately.
Being confrontational will never convince anyone, Conservative. Unless confronted by God Himself. You catch a lot more flies with Honey than Vinegar. You should just think about that.
Conservative and Alprova, you guys are arguing Apples and Oranges. Al does not believe that the Bible is the Word of God and Conservative only uses the Word of God as his authority. It seems to me that you guys arguing is useless until you can agree on an authority to argue with.
It would be like me arguing with someone that 2+2=4 using a Math book but the other person says that Math is a myth. So there is no substantiation to the argument. I would need to prove it with physical evidence or the other person would have to accept on faith that my math book was correct.
I hope that made sense. Conservative, you make very good arguments using the Bible. But you are never going to convince Al of anything until you guys can agree on the source.
And since you think that BO would be "hailed as one of the best", it is my contention that had he been white he would have never been elected at all and possibly we would have had Hillary for the past 6 years.
Alprova said, "By all measures, if Barack Obama were white and a Republican, he would be hailed as one of the best Presidents in history. But sadly, he is not white, and he's certainly not a Republican, so he is vilified as being the worst."
Come on Al. You are the one that is always challenging folks to show there proof when they make a statement like that. Yes you are entitled to your opinion but you make this statement like it is fact.
I, like Fairmon, do not base my opinion on the POTUS according to his race and you have no room to judge that against us. I judge based on what I see. And MY OPINION is that he stinketh at being a president. Fairmon is usually one of the most neutral posters on here. What makes you think otherwise about him?
Al, Wow!!! you should feel like a new man. That is totally amazing. Glad to hear you are doing so well.
I am good. Just need to loose about 80 pounds or I will be the one having a bypass. For now my diabetes is under control too. Just wanted you to know I have prayed for you.
I have watched the video of the grocery store robbery. It was definitely Mike Brown. If he was as aggressive to the policeman as he was to the grocery store clerk then I can see why the event escalated. I would like to see the autopsy. It will help the investigation. I also wish there was a dash cam but I guess there was not.
AS stated before, more of the whole story will come in time.